Indeed, gyro meat, which can consist of beef, veal, lamb, pork or otherwise, is roasted vertically in a cone shape that spins as it cooks. The Calvert Journal ("a daily briefing on the culture and creativity of modern Russia"), Arnold Zwicky's list of blogs and resources, Cambridge International Dictionary of Idioms, TITUS: Thesaurus Indogermanischer Text- und Sprachmaterialien, American Heritage Dictionary Indo-European Roots Appendix, Andras Rajki's Etymological Dictionary of Arabic, Das Deutsche Wörterbuch von Jacob und Wilhelm Grimm, Trésor de la langue française informatisé, Centre National de Ressources Textuelles et Lexicales, Vocabolario Etimologico della Lingua Italiana, RAI Dizionario d’Ortografia e di Pronunzia, electronic Dictionary of the Irish Language, MacBain's Etymological Dictionary of the Gaelic Language (1911 edition), Λεξικό της κοινής νεοελληνικής [Modern Greek Dictionary], LBG (Lexikon zur byzantinischen Gräzität = Lexicon of Byzantine Greek), Большой толково-фразеологический словарь Михельсона, Nişanyan's Turkish Etymological Dictionary. In the Netherlands we call the Greek thing Gyros ( pronounced geeros with a Dutch, throat-searing g) and the Turkish stuff Döner. In the case of Canada, if doner was used first, if Greek restaurants introduced the dish out of awareness of its popularity in other restaurants, where it was called doner, they may have used doner rather than their own name in order to attract customers already familiar with the dish under its Turkish name.” That may well be the case, but an additional fact that Bill tosses in at the end may be important here: “Incidentally, the Greek term is actually derived from the Turkish. The rumour around here is that donair originated out of Nova Scotia…. London OPEN NOW 0207 536 0723 I don’t think I’ve heard a blended /ʹʤi: ɹoʷ/ (jee-row) or a Spanish-style /ʹhi: ɹoʷ/ (hee-row), but neither would really shock me. Just like the word’s pronunciation in the U.S. North of the border the doner used a much sweeter sauce, compared to the gyro’s brighter cucumber sauce. The only time I ever heard jye-roe was if someone was joking or didn’t know any better. LBG (Lexikon zur byzantinischen Gräzität = Lexicon of Byzantine Greek) The donair spread to Alberta with Maritime workers migrating for work, so that is why the spelling “donair” is prevalent in Alberta, and to some extent BC. But I’ve heard plenty of people in the area who say JYE-roe too. I had the opportunity to finally taste the delicacy considered the big daddy of the Arab shawarma, the Greek gyros, and the Mexican al pastor. Back in 2012, I had a dream to bring together two of my favorite foods from around the world. Centre National de Ressources Textuelles et Lexicales electronic Dictionary of the Irish Language Perhaps the confusion on my part is due to a vendor giving me the wrong food in New York, but I am sure I asked for a Gyro and recieved a Pita, with chicken, lettuce, onion, tomato, and tetziki sauce. It’s been a while, so I may be wrong. Also, is there any etymological connexion with the “hero” (submarine, hoagie) sandwich? correction: nativized and non-exoticized both fall under “native”. As far as I know, they were always called gyros in just about every part of Canada except where I’m from: Nova Scotia, where we call them donairs. I’m from Houston and currently live in Colorado and have been taught to say “yee-ro” for this dish. In Ireland, doner kebabs were introduced in the 1980s by Abrakebabra, a chain started by an Irishman who’d seen them in London. So how do you go about pronouncing the name of this dish with the typical Greek pronunciation? Language Log Taste great but don't leave a half eaten one in the wastebasket in a closed hotel room on a hot day after an all-night Halifax pub crawl - you could wake up asphyxiated; or wish you had been. Instant Pot Gyro Recipe | Doner Kabab Gyro Meat | TwoSleevers An ka taa (resources and lessons for Bambara, Dioula, Malinké, and Mandinka) Gyros? At the very least, though, it’s a common idea in Germany if nowhere else, so even if it’s wrong it’s not unlikely that the proprietor of the place you mentioned picked it up there. The Daily Growler † It’s pork on a vertical rotisserie, seasoned similar to the way gyros are in the US, served in pita bread, and accompanied by a dark, spicy sauce. What’s donair sauce like? ), which contains mutton? Apparently he was right. I just wanted to add the data point that they are always called donairs in British Columbia as far as I can tell, even though most of the places selling them are Greek. In Washington, I often hear the ‘yee-row’ pronunciation, but the ‘jye-roe’ version isn’t uncommon. According to reports, the first person to serve gyros in America was George Apostolou, in 1965, before opening Central Gyro Wholesale nearly a decade later and beginning his eventual reign over the U.S. gyro market. Rest assured, “Vegas” is VAY-guss. We’ve always pronounced ‘gyro’ like ‘gear-o’. But conflicting stories among other cooks and manufacturers of who actually introduced the sandwich to Americans first is still hotly debated. That would be kebap then. Commented-On Language Hat Posts (courtesy of J.C.; contains useful Random Link feature). General Discussion. Although, I have been told that donair sauce is something quite unique to our area. Arnold Zwicky's list of blogs and resources Far Outliers Listen to the audio pronunciation in the Cambridge English Dictionary. My impression is that this makes the word sound more exotic. All comments are copyright their original posters. In Montreal, we say “Ye-roe” or “Jye-roe”. §35. It’s an interesting regional split (assuming, as I do, that my brother, as he says, reflects universal SoCal usage), and for this too I would welcome further information. ... so at least for now the meat inside the sandwich is of the pre-sliced gyro variety, a … MetaFilter It’s a fascinating tale, and the photos will make you hungry! In Mexico, they are called “tacos arabes,” introduced, apparently, by Arab immigrants to Puebla, where they are very common (it can be now considered a typical food of Puebla). rare–1. ТЕТРАДКИ: Что о нас думают в Европе? Peter Gamoulakos, of Halifax, was inspired by the gyros he ate on his trips back home to Greece and wanted to introduce them at his pizza shop in Halifax. Monier-Williams Sanskrit Dictionary Real Academia dictionary (Spanish) Doner & Gyros Dubai; Doner & Gyros, DIFC; Order online from Doner & Gyros in Dubai; Get Menu, Reviews, Order Online, Home Delivery, Delivery, Contact, Location, Phone Number, Maps and more for Doner & Gyros Restaurant on Zomato The Halifax donair differs from the doner or gyros described above in that it includes a thick white sauce apparently based on condensed milk, instead of tzatziki. Græcize, Grecize, v. Cambridge International Dictionary of Idioms I take it that most non-American english speakers prefer something more along the lines of ka-BAB. I obediently asked for two yeeroes; the counterman looked at me, puzzled, then said “Two jyeroes?” My brother gave up in disgust. OpenSpace.ru (Russian cultural links) This is part of a more general American tendency to use the PALM vowel rather than the TRAP vowel for A in foreign words. Shouldn’t the sticklers for authenticity be worrying about the question of singular versus plural as well as the pronunciation of the first syllable? The pita freezes perfectly too. 1853 RUSKIN Stones Ven. 81 note, His habit of Grecising the names of undoubted Huns. . If you’re reproducing the borrowed word more accurately, how can that be called exotic? Mag. It is seen by most as a cheaper and riskier sort of fast food, and the foodstands get attacked regularly by authorities on sanitation grounds, which is probably why there are not as many of them now, at least in Moscow. I encoutered Gyros during my vacation to New York last year. "Until we are able to find a viable housing solution, it will be very hard to come up with any public health solutions," said Richard Ducatenzeiler, executive director of Franciscan Outreach. How about the second word: is it VEE-guhs? I didn’t know until reading the LL post that they were the same thing! Avva (Russian) Most people chose this as the best definition of donner: (South Africa, slang) To... See the dictionary meaning, pronunciation, and sentence examples. Shouldn’t that be “Hellenizing” instead of “Grecizing” (sic)? San Juan), Slovak, Sri Lanka, Vivaldi, wigwam, Yasser. II. Pronouncing “Las Vegas” like “Los Vegas” seems unfortunate. It’s also worth noting that while us Americans call the meat-on-a-stick ka-BOB, I take it that most non-American english speakers prefer something more along the lines of ka-BAB. There are salads and sides too. i. No-sword YouTube. The non-Turks who already used “döner” helped propagate it to a wider group than those who non-Turks who used “gyros” did. Nowadays “Işkender kebap” tends to refer to döner meat sliced thick and served on a pide bread covered in a tomato and yoghurt sauce. I have always believed the original term “hero” did derive from the Greek “gyro.” Moreover, the doner kebab which I regularly had and loved in Germany (and occasionally in Japan) were also spiced and presented differently than the gyros (which I only had in the U.S. LH, this is what you get for mentioning food. My wife and I honeymooned in Nova Scotia which was where we discovered the doner, but we did find is two subtle distinctions. I just came across this old post but I have something to contribute, as I have been doing lots of research on the donair/gyro in Canada. I’m guessing younger people especially imagine them to be totally Mexican. 1840 Blackw. KEBABS aka KABOBS have a long history. The sci.lang FAQ bab.la Hope people are still interested in the debate. Cornish dictionary online At any rate, the letter gamma is pronounced as a voiced velar fricative before back vowels, but as y before front ones. Americans pronounce the a in Las pretty much the way Spanish speakers do. 646 To Graecize or not to Graecize had become a test of patriotic feeling. They came out with gyros maybe 10 or 15 years ago, and their ads made a big point of saying it’s pronounced year-oh. Dictionary of the Scots Language Pronunciation of Gyros with 2 audio pronunciations, 6 translations, 28 sentences and more for Gyros. The PALM vowel is much rarer than the TRAP vowel in core vocabulary, excluding BATH and pre-//R// words. Both taste great, … Dictionnaires d'autrefois Thus, the döner was born. In central Texas, I always heard it as “yeero.” There are now a few authentically Turkish kebab shops. This stereotype is becoming less true. MacBain's Etymological Dictionary of the Gaelic Language (1911 edition) Tower of Babel etymological database How to say gyro. Haquelebac I, having grown up in New Jersey, had never even been aware of that pronunciation before this post. Maybe because there is a vast difference in quality between the excellent doners I’ve had in Turkey and Germany, and the pretty mediocre product slathered in bland yogurt sauce, accompanied by tasteless tomatoes and served on flaccid pita bread that one generally finds in New England. So I’ve pretty much given up eating them at all. Here in Moscow we didn’t have any of the above (doner, gyros or shwarma) until roughly fifteen years ago. I first came across gyros when I moved to a new city to attend the university there. Lexilogos (French) He-ro? Vasmer's etymological dictionary(Russian) Nick Jainschigg At any rate, I’ve never had confusion from a counter-man when using that pronunciation. Some additional ill-informed speculation: in BrE, the COT vowel require an O spelling, while the PALM, THOUGHT and GOAT vowels require long vowels, so the TRAP vowel is the choice for short A (kebAb) and the COT vowel for short O (kOsovo). However, you may be interested to hear that the name “donair” came about as more of an accident than a deliberate naming based on ethnicity or the market. Gyro. Dicționare ale limbii române (Earliest known cite is from the 1937 Lexicon of Trade Jargon — see Barry Popik’s page for more.) (OK, that’s not quite how I’d pronounce it, but I’ve never eaten any…), “Doner” is pronounced like “donor” and I’ve seen it written thus, Vowel harmony strikes back! Turkish doner kebab and Turkish-by-way-of-Germany doner kebab are two very different animals. Not sure what you mean by that; I’d say it’s one of the worse spelling systems around, having been created for a completely different phonetic system. But it sounds like what you get in NY is neither! You do want to roll your R rather strongly. Lizok's Bookshelf There are now a few authentically Turkish kebab shops. Nick Jainschigg's blog 1692 R. L’ESTRANGE Josephus, Antiq. I’ve lived most of my life in and around Melbourne, Australia. It sounds rather provincial to me. (Please excuse intuitive renderings of sounds.) A Dictionary of Tocharian B (with etymologies) Favorite rave review, by Teju Cole: As for the “-s,” in my experience people here treat it as a plural suffix, dropping it in attributive or singular use and pronouncing it /z/ in plural use. If you have accumulated any more info about this over the years I would love to get in contact with you. Sh(a)warma is basically the same thing, but as I recall tends to be spiced differently. Gyros are in fact, a variation of Kebab. […]. I live in Halifax, where the donair (pronounced dow-nair) is very popular and made in a variety of places. To assimilate to what is Greek; to give a Greek cast, character, or form to. The quality varies very widely, of course. It's a beacon of attentiveness and crisp thinking, and an excellent substitute for the daily news.". Старославянский словарь [Old Church Slavic dictionary] Latin Dictionary and Grammar Aid “Doner kebab” is usually abbreviated to “kebab” except when ordering, just as you’d say “I had a hamburger” rather than “I had a quarter-pounder with cheese”. There is no finer food when you’re having difficulty focusing and standing up. Bah. In Poland, they would be called kebab (some places add döner at the beginning but ignore the umlaut in pronouncing it) and are usually served in a kind of flat roll that doesn’t seem to be used for anything else. Russian literature online Diccionari català Devanco Foods, another Chicago area gyro producer, also credits Apostolou and his brothers with creating the gyro empire. BibleOnline Some years later, the pronunciation became SHWAR-ma. 126 One who ‘Græcises’ in language or mode of life. Online Etymology Dictionary Probably because of the same confusion with hero sandwiches noted above–and as a result of some actual people of Greek descent here pronouncing the “g” as something between a y, an h, and the ch in loch (which is almost the correct Modern Greek pronunciation of gamma, but not quite) –I’ve actually heard people in upper Michigan use a pronunciation that more or less sounds exactly like “hero.” The h is a little rougher, but not by very much. In London, Ontario, where I grew up, they were called “gyros”, and the menus at Mr. Souvlaki (a food-stand of such eminence that for a time someone at a downtown office kept a Web camera pointed at it) took pains to give phonetic pronunciation. 1892 Guardian 18 May 743/3 The MS. quite certainly does not Latinise but Graecises. Digital Dictionaries of South Asia Separated by a common language Like Bill, I’d love to hear from anyone who has more information. Ru_slang (Russian) Came back to southern NH, ten miles from the house I grew up in. Here it’s spiced mutton (sometimes mutton/beef combo), with yogurt/cucumber sauce, and loads of tomatoes and onions (sometimes with red peppers.). The gyroscope and the gyro (food) both refer to something turning (part of the instrument rotates, and the bread around the contents of the gyro is rolled), we should all relax and say jeye-row in both cases. — “Do you want much or not so much meat?” A chicken gyro? “In the early 90’s an ‘authentic’ kebap place that advertised (paraphrasing) “Authentic Berlin-style Kebab! I never eat the stuff. Most interestingly, while it is called шаурма (sha-oor-MUH) in Moscow, in Saint-Petersburg they call it шаверма (sha-VER-muh). The only time I’ve seen the word “doner” was in Montreal and Toronto, where they have more of a Turkish population. The *Bʰlog ("A blog devoted to all matters Indo-European") You can eat one in the Greek restaurants and the other in the Turkish ones. :-] All other messages and opinions expressed herein are those of the author and do not necessarily state or reflect those of languagehat.com. Since I was also beginning Modern Greek I ended up opting for YEE-roh although most people said JIE-roh (I don’t think I’ve ever heard JEE-roh though it would seem to be a possibility). Словарь русских народных говоров [Russian dialect dictionary] Depends on who you ask. The Cassandra Pages Gyros are thought to have originated in Greece as a food descendent of Turkey’s doner kebab and the Middle East’s shawarma. In Toronto they’re usually called gyros: I’ve never seen one called a doner. Greek γύρος ‘turning’ is a calque of a Turkish original that was first borrowed into Greek, then replaced after independence.” I’d like to know more about the history of this; if it was indeed replaced after independence (i.e., in the early 19th century), then it’s irrelevant here, but if it remained in common use (like many other Turkish-derived terms) until after the Greco-Turkish War of 1919-1922 it’s possible that the early Greek restaurateurs in Canada called the dish ντονέρ [doner] and naturally used the term in their menus. The name itself comes from 'Kababa', a bastardization of the ancient Aramaic word for "char or burn". Fascinating. It’s served in a pita, usually with onions and cucumber sauce. Boris Dralyuk Mongolian/English dictionary Word Oddities Yur-ro? Wikipedia:Reference desk/Language In central New York, I almost always hear “jyro,” from restaurateurs as well as patrons. I’ve avoided ordering them at times because either way I say it will be wrong. The first time I ever ordered a Jye-roe, at the State Fair in Alaska, the counterman told me to pronounce it “Yee-roh”. 3 Josephus endeavours to Grecize, and shape the history of the Jews as like as he could to those of the Greeks and Romans. Barry Guy Gyro. I’d never heard of a donair until I moved out to Calgary. As far as I know, we nearly always respect the /ö/ in döner, and most of us would hear a change to anything like /o/ as a blunder. Gyro is probably the most often mispronounced food name. Do Brits really say “Lass”? a. The Flaxen Wave The point of the “authentic Berlin-style kebab” is that supposedly the “modern”, internationally popular form of döner kebab (with salad and sauce in a pita) was invented by Turkish immigrants in Berlin in the 1970s and spread from there. Das Deutsche Wörterbuch von Jacob und Wilhelm Grimm Most Melburnians revel in this diversity, whose benefits include culinary cosmopolitanism. Nişanyan's Turkish Etymological Dictionary The G is not pronounced like a G in Greek. It flustered my college girlfriend, who was from Maryland and said YEE-roh, which usually prompted corrections from the (generally Greek) countermen. I’ve always wanted to know what was the difference between a gyros and a döner. I thought the Canadian usage was derived from the British term. Poemas del río Wang bulbulovo How to pronounce döner kebab. So that’s a little bit the Greek equivalent to the Turkish Doner Kebab. A kebab is, according to the stereotype of unimaginative stand-up comedians ripping off Billy Connolly c.1980, the greasy food of choice when staggering home from the pub, and something you’d never touch when sober. Donairs (doner kebab), gyros, and shawarma all share the same origin. Laudator Temporis Acti cf Wikipedia list: annato, Bangladesh, Caracas, chianti, Galapagos, Gdansk, grappa, gulag, Hanoi, Jan (male name, e.g. Gyro…. TypeIt (IPA keyboards, language character sets) I thought döner kebap always contains chicken, as opposed to şişkebap (spelling? 1827 G. HIGGINS Celtic Druids 200 note, This word, as usual, they Græcised. The Kanji Site Bill Poser has a Language Log post on the curious fact that the identical (and delicious) roast-meat product is known in the U.S. as gyro(s) and in Canada as doner or donair (from the Turkish döner). Balashon Shouldn’t that be “Hellenizing” instead of “Grecizing” (sic)? Conscientious You will not only get your purchases, you will get my blessings and a karmic boost! Logeion (Greek-to-English and Latin-to-English dictionary search) In Wrocław, they use a slightly different kind of roll and call it a knysza(!). See the Update above for the full story of Canadian doner. 1879 FARRAR St. Paul I. Wuthering Expectations This article contains new, firsthand information uncovered by its reporter(s). The Millions How did Elvis pronounce it in “Viva Las Vegas!”? “Tacos al pastor,” which seem to also have descended from the Arabic vertical rotisserie, are always served in corn tortillas and they are not seasoned in any way to make them taste Arabic. Pronouncing “Las Vegas” like “Los Vegas” seems unfortunate. I don’t remember how it was done in Nebraska (I never ate them there) but I think it might have been ‘jye-roe’ there, too. According to reports, the first person to serve gyros in America was George Apostolou, in 1965, before opening Central Gyro Wholesale nearly a decade later and beginning his eventual reign over the U.S. gyro market. If I did somehow find myself ordering a gyros (despite being a vegetarian) in Anglophone lands, I’d probably end up attempting to use the Greek-ish pronunciation (accent aside), although I might also cause serious confusion by flubbing into my German habits and more or less saying [“gy:Ros] or [“gy:R\os]. The same meat in a corn tortilla is called “orientales.” Gyro. If you’re ordering a gyro for lunch, you pronounce it yee-roh or zhihr-oh. But this comes up infrequently so I’m not sure what the local custom is. From my experience Donair and Gyro are separate things entirely. If we say jee-row or yee-row, don’t we have to switch to jee-row-scope? Arak-29 (Armenian links) It still makes us hungry.. This Vegan Falafel Is a Party in a Sandwich + Newsletter Shop Site Feedback FAQ / Help Center. The donair was invented in Halifax in 1973 and is a derivative of the gyro. To add to what Noetica said: My impression is that in AmE, “Las (Vegas)” has the PALM vowel, while “Los (Angeles)” has the CAUGHT vowel; in BrE, “Las (Vegas)” has the TRAP vowel, while “Los (Angeles)” has the LOT vowel. At least 12,974 people have died from COVID-19 in Illinois, and another 808 deaths are considered to be probably related. RAI Dizionario d’Ortografia e di Pronunzia (includes proper names) Speculative Grammarian In fact, the Turkish root of döner` “turning” is the source for the word for convert “dönmeh” by which the Jewish followers of the False Messiah Sabetai Zvi are known. How do we typically say these? Depends on who you ask. III. More generally, since there are different numbers and realisations of the low vowels in BrE and AmE, it’s understandable that the nearest-approximating native phoneme to an exotic phoneme may differ. Since then I have never heard a single person say “Yee-roh”, and I have had countermen give confused looks when I used it. Cheers! Come check Doners & Gyros's menu and see different types of food that are not only suitable for you but for your kids, as well. dic.academic.ru (Russian dictionary search) I too grew up in Chicago, home to a whole lot of Greeks, and yee-roe is the only pronunciation used. Большой толково-фразеологический словарь Михельсона (1896-1912) Pronounce "gyros" correctly, impress your friends! Minority Languages of Russia Национальный корпус русского языка (Corpus of the Russian Language) wood s lot † an eudæmonist Sentence first At the time, the article claimed Kronos was the world’s largest producer of gyros (and that all other gyro “titans” were Chicago-based as well). Zhongwen.com The first is a little easier to pronounce. “Yee-ro” would apply to a single sandwich, as in, “I want a gyro,” while “yee-ros” would be the correct pronunciation if you were to say, “I love gyros,” Greek experts said. KOD “merged’ with Velos Pizza ( I am not sure through what commercial operation) and this merger is what justifies its claim to having been the first donair maker in the area. Dictionnaire de l’Académie francaise What about Shwarma? Transblawg Trésor de la langue française informatisé The Hellenized pronunciation of gyro as /jiro/ mentioned by Languagehat has evidently led to folk-etymological speculation that it’s the origin of hero. Not being a native (or frequent) speaker of English and having spent my entire life on another continent, I can’t really comment much on the original topic. If you want to taste the best Doner in town, you should try Doners and Gyros's salivating kebabs, and their other sumptous dishes suited for your cravings. Gyro meat freezes perfectly! Also, the gyro always seemed to contain a lot more garlic. Then I moved away for thirteen years. Philology.ru GREEKTOWN — It’s true Chicago has been known for its pizzas, hot dogs and Italian beef — but there’s another meat, sauce and bread combo city dwellers drool for: gyros. This includes directly interviewing sources and research / analysis of primary source documents. The original inventor was the proprietor of Velos Pizza, in Bedford, formerly a separate town but now incorporated into Halifax. As a news piece, this article cites verifiable, third-party sources which have all been thoroughly fact-checked and deemed credible by the Newsroom in accordance with the Civil Constitution. A Kebab is a piece of grilled meat, or shaped, grilled mince meat. YEE. Jabal al-Lughat Döner kebab? I live in Boston, where the pronunciation is the same. iv. The JYE/YEE thing has always confused me: I grew up in southern NH and went to college for a while in Western Mass, and in both places, everyone always said JYE-roh. ii. (I don't otherwise participate in Twitter. A daily dose of neighborhood news delivered to your inbox every morning. The Untranslated They differ slightly from each other, Gyros tends to be more refined while Döner is sometimes spiced in a very industrial-tasting way, but the main difference is that Gyros comes with tzatziki and Döner usually doesn’t. 2. plural form of gyroOrigin From Greek γύρος (gýros, “gyro, doner kebab”). This Newsmaker has been deemed by this Newsroom as having a specialized knowledge of the subject covered in this article. I’m from Texas, but my family is originally from Chicago. There are salads and sides too. Turner kebab! ‘The doner kebab was served with fresh yogurt, ketchup and butter.’ ‘To wit: crusty shards of doner kebab (spit-roasted lamb-and-beef that is the Turkish version of gyros) are piled on toasted bread croutons and sauced with tomato and wildly tart, runny yogurt.’ ‘I looked for an idea, and spotted the concept of the doner …